Bop-Bop-Bop...

Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
They're also holding the tension of the springs as well.
Indeed - all in all a massive amount of force. If they gave way (& the back end was up in the air) at least the downward trajectory of the lower link would be restricted by the vertical 'play' these have in the cross member they bolt into under the middle of the car :cool:
 

Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
Problems, problems....

I have now got BOP's back end back together & the ride height looks like it should:

IMG_3506.JPG

..compared with the 'before' height:

IMG_3137.JPG

The diff' isn't back in yet, so there will be a slight drop but not much. In fact, the height is within 2mm of "Hazel's" ride height, - so far so good. However, the shock absorbers are at full stretch because when you push the rear corners down & release, the back end jumps up & 'snatches' as the shocks meet their maximum length.

As stated before, the springs are around 20mm longer than the WSM data for normal springs. It looks like to get stiffer & progressive springs that work well with the shocks, they should actually be more like standard length. A comparison with Hazel (which is excellent) is as follows:

Height of wheel arch from ground:
Hazel 546mm BOP 548mm

With approx 70kg person sitting above:
Hazel 520mm BOP 530mm

With approx 100kg person:
Hazel 502mm BOP 520mm

BOP's current springs are clearly much stiffer (which is OK) but I think too long & don't give way enough under normal loading. Incidentally, when I first replaced the rear springs in my 2000, I think I tried to get some front ones in :rolleyes: & the result was much the same. (Front ones have a free length of around 40mm more than standard rears, so would be around 20mm longer than the ones I've just put in BOP).

Comparing the top mountings of the shocks, they are very similar in length fixed through the upper mounts:

Hazel:

IMG_3507.JPG

BOP:

IMG_3508.JPG

Any ideas, please?
 

harveyp6

Well-Known Member
Hazel has the correct mounting rubbers and washers, BOP has the wrong ones. Whether this has anything to do with your problem I couldn's say, other than to say the shocks could be wrong as well as the rubbers and washers.
 

Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
Thanks Harvey, I'd suspected that although as you say, I don't think that causes the problem. The amount of 'spindle' taken up by rubbers (both inside & outside the mounting holes at each end of the shocks) is about the same for both cars.

The shocks are the ones that came off BOP in the first place & they worked fine with standard springs.
 

Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
Hazel has the correct mounting rubbers and washers, BOP has the wrong ones. Whether this has anything to do with your problem I couldn's say, other than to say the shocks could be wrong as well as the rubbers and washers.
Just seen this on eBay - with the smaller mounts. Probably not original Rover spec.:rolleyes: but they are the same shocks that were on BOP when I got it.

s-l1600 (320x240) (2).jpg
 

Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
Hazel has the correct mounting rubbers and washers, BOP has the wrong ones. Whether this has anything to do with your problem I couldn's say, other than to say the shocks could be wrong as well as the rubbers and washers.
Upon further investigation Harvey, it looks like the 'wrong' rubbers are those for a 2000, not the V8. The lower mounts on BOP's shocks are the correct type, so the tops must have been changed at some point.
A friend did suggest that I may have got 2000 shocks on the back by mistake - they fit to a domed lower plate on 2000s, so may be a shorter length. However, I have now checked with some spares I have & the travel seems to be the same, so I'll have to remove the shocks on the car & check they have full travel, before I look into returning the springs for a different pair....
 

Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
After much deliberation I had a thought - would it be different if I put the diff, calipers & discs back in...? :rolleyes: Now that I have, things look much better & I think the car will be right.

That problem may be sorted, so on to the next... hoping to get the brakes bled yesterday, I bled the rears I moved to the fronts & (you've guessed it) the near-side bleed screw sheared :mad:. It still has a few mm protruding from the caliper, so I just might be lucky. I'll remove the caliper & either heat with a blowtorch (probably not enough) or try & weld a nut to it which may also help with heat. Watch this space.....

In the meantime, for anyone who hasn't had a look at rear brakes, here are two pictures for you (both looking from the front):

Handbrake off, with the 'quadrants' on the end stops:

IMG_3679.JPG

Handbrake pulled on to push cups & inner brake pad out towards the disc:

IMG_3680.JPG

Early Dunlop brakes are different to these, but most P6s have the above brakes..
 
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mrtask

Well-Known Member
Thanks for those really useful pics Phil, the penny has dropped! I think I might just've finally understand what a Quadrant is and how to see if it/they are adjusted properly! I don't know how many times I've read and re-read the workshop manual and the Haynes book of lies, all I know is I didn't ever really understand either the written instructions, or how the rear brakes themselves are supposed to function. A 'Eureka!' moment for me! ;)
 

Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
Thanks for those really useful pics Phil, the penny has dropped! I think I might just've finally understand what a Quadrant is and how to see if it/they are adjusted properly! I don't know how many times I've read and re-read the workshop manual and the Haynes book of lies, all I know is I didn't ever really understand either the written instructions, or how the rear brakes themselves are supposed to function. A 'Eureka!' moment for me! ;)
Glad to be of service!

I've had difficulty getting the front caliper main bolts undone, but have managed it (at least they didn't snap!). I've cleaned the remains of the bleed screw up & will attempt to weld a bolt onto it hopefully on Thursday. I'll report back & tell you how it goes o_O Hopefully the heat from the weld will help, too.

IMG_3683.JPG
 

Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
Well this didn't go quite to plan & a good friend came to the rescue with his oxy-acetylene gear. Heating the corner of the caliper up & gently teasing the screw with a stud extractor eventually saw it give in!

I put everything back together, bled the system & drove 70 miles yesterday to see if all was well. It broadly was, so MOT today & it passed with only a slightly worn ball joint as advisory :)

The uprated rear springs are great with no problems. They make the car sit perhaps a little high to some, but I like the stance & of course it settles a bit with the driver in!

IMG_3710.JPG
 

Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
Next job is to replace the near side steering side rod as the ball joint nearest the bulkhead has some play in it. Surprisingly the castellated nuts came off without too much grief, but splitting the side links from the steering mechanism is proving a real pain.

IMG_3794.JPG

I just have a basic balljoint splitter like a big forked wedge, but without braying the car to bits, this isn't helping much. Has anyone got any ideas please?
 

GRTV8

Well-Known Member
I squirted some diesel on it over for a few days- the time between thinking about replacing the balljoint and actualy getting it. So was a week in reality.
The splitter did the job with ease, albeit under huge pressure. She let go with a massif bang. Nearly shit myself. But hey it wasnt going anywhere as the splitter and castle nut held it in place.
My splitter cost $40 at Supercheap Auto. A screw down type. Not a bash bash type.
 

arthuy

Well-Known Member
Looking good.

I like how the rear sits, with a bit of weight or few passengers should drop it a tad so prob as close to perfect as you can get.
 
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Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
Thanks guys, I've ordered a screw type splitter so will see how that works.

Looking good.

I like how the rear sits, it a bit of weight or few passengers would drop it a tad so prob as close to perfect as you can get.
Many thanks! I'm pleased with both this & 'Hazel's' stance. Not everyone's cup of tea, I know.
 

Phil Robson

Well-Known Member
This is the splitter I ordered:

IMG_3823.JPG

It must have taken all of 30 seconds to remove each ball joint :cool: (Plus a little adjustment to get the tool in the best place for each), but what a tool for £10!

Whilst BOP was in the garage, I put the n/s outer sill on:

IMG_3824.JPG

It's great when everything's nice & clean. It's taken me many many years to get to this point with my P6s, & 'Hazel's' front wing removal will probably be hard going yet as they've not been off in the 11 years I've had the car.

Another interesting point I've mentioned before is the fact that BOP has a fibreglass front valance:

IMG_3801.JPG

I've never knowingly seen one before anywhere o_O. Has anyone else seen one?
(I will be replacing this with a good steel one from my late friend & P6 guru Ian McDonald).
 
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