Storage headaches

K

KiwiRover

Active Member
So with an overabundance of cars and parts on my property a while ago I decided to hire a storage unit to tidy things up a bit. The place I ended up with had a bunch of new shipping containers in a secure site for a reasonable price so I hired a 30ft container at the end of 2011 and parked my '73 V8 in there and proceeded to fill the space behind it with spare panels, seats, motors etc. This meant that the car couldn't be accessed without removing everything else so it sat in there for the next 3 and a half years. Now that my new garage is finally done I decided to empty out the unit and save myself a few bucks in hireage. Gradually the boxes and panels were removed until all that was left was the car and some doors on a shelf over the bonnet. Unfortunately the 2 tyres closest to the wall had gone flat but armed with some tools, spare tyres, fuel and a fresh battery my mate and I went in there last Saturday morning.

We started by jacking the back up and dragging it sideways to access the back wheel. We soon noticed that the brakes were stuck solid. Removing the outer pads revealed them to be rusted onto the discs (no I didn't leave the handbrake on) so they were cleaned up with sandpaper and reassembled. Of course the front brakes were rusted on too so they had to be removed and cleaned and the clutch pedal appeared to be seized though this eventually responded to a bit of CRC and some levering up and down. All this took about 4 hours working in a confined space. We were finally able to roll the car back enough to open the bonnet. This is what we found:


Devastated! This engine was rebuilt about a year before going in to storage with the edelbrock manifold and carb, uprated cam and oil pump and an SD1 5 speed fitted. Everything was locked solid. The alternator came unstuck after a power bar was applied to the pulley and I've managed to get the engine to turn slightly but it doesn't look good. The car also has some nasty stains on the recently painted bonnet from drips off the ceiling and there is a bit of mould on the armrests and headling and a few other spots inside the car. This was a pretty solid car. Interior is good, no rust anywhere, sundym, PAS etc. Just needed a decent paint job but now I guess I'm having to replace the motor and brakes too. :(
 
Wish I had known, I would have advised you very strongly that this is a disastrous thing to do, Steel shipping containers suffer from condensation in the extreme. The need venting to let the moist air out (fan assisted is better).
Very sorry to see that sight, you have my condolences.
 
Yes, it does seem to be a condensation issue. The storage people have been checking it for leaks but I don't think they'll find anything. It was quite a new container when I moved in. My concern is that they are advertising these things as suitable for storing cars (among other things) and I have never seen this much corrosion on an engine with a couple of exceptions; there is a knackered 2000TC motor sitting in the back of my carport that has been under a drip for 10+ years, that's not quite as bad as this. And I once bought a P6B that had sat in a field for decades that was a bit worse.
But I would have been better off leaving the car under a cover on my driveway. I am currently in negotiations with them as I feel some compensation should be in order. We'll see what happens...
 
Hopefully they will come to the party on that one.
The mechanism is very simple, its not water leaks that cause the problem, a semi sealed container when warms has a certain volume of warm moist air inside, as the outside ambient cools so does the container causing a vacuum which sucks in more moist air which due to the now lowered temperature condensates onto the cold metal surfaces. The semi sealed nature then becomes the real demon in the equation as the water has no where to escape to, day after day for any extended time means that there is an ever increasing volume of water that cant escape due to the sealed nature which will relieve pressure but not water.
To make it worse as the container reheats a small quantity of the water will turn to vapour ( PV=nRT and all that ) which is hotter than the air temp other wise it wouldn't be vapour ie steam, and as you can guess corrosion is far quicker with heat.

The solution is venting the container as mentioned above, active ventilation with a fan is best.

I used to have this problem with mountain top sealed radio stations (windowless Portacom buildings) , sealed antenna arrays and more latterly with sealed illuminated road signs, the solution is always venting. I had one of my workers who used a couple of shipping containers for storage, left them for about 10 years every thing was rusted beyond recognition and all the wooden furniture was powder.
My cousin also put some P.A. equipment into 6 months storage, every thing was at the point of failure when he took it out, took me a few weeks to get the P.A system to work again.

All of this was in the low humidity south not the super humid Auckland climate where this would be hugely worse.


Graeme
 
Ah mate what a bugger .
Years ago I too had gear that I stored in a container, but only opened it on a weekly basis for the day . Not 4 yrs as in your case.
I thought the roof was leaking and nailed corrugated over the top.
Everything was still wet especially the walls so created an air flow by gas axing holes all round the container . This helped but not totally , as mildew was abundant on anything that would support it .
Still an expensive and demoralising exercise for you .
Hope the container dudes come to the party.
Gerald
 
Ooh, that is a sickener. :-(
Had a similar thing happen about 15 years ago to a lovely 'S' I owned, I parked it for about a month in a friends asbestos roofed garage, to get it out of the way for a bit. When I went to remove it, the car was absolutely smothered in condensation, the brakes were stuck on, the clutch was stuck on & under the bonnet had just started to show the signs. I caught it just in time.
 
Damn. Remember as well that condensation forms inside sills and box sections. It can kill a car even if its never seen the rain. I'd get the cover sills off ASAP for a look.
 
Ah, bad luck. Sorry to see it in such a state.

Do you reckon the internals on the engine are that bad? That efflorescence and rust on the outside is nasty, but inside should have been shielded from the worst of the moisture, shouldn`t it? In the photo most of the corrosion looked to be on the ancillaries, though I wouldn`t fancy my chances with those inlet manifold studs!

it might be worth turning it over slowly. remove the alternator. You could try the screwdriver blade in a power drill priming trick with the oil pump first.

Hope it can be saved.
 
That's such a disheartening sight to see. I have a P5 awaiting restoration as well as all the parts for my 3500S in a shipping container about 10 mins from home and I've always been concerned about the effect of the heating and cooling cycle on moisture levels inside. I've placed several of those large silica gel packs around the container but I don't think they help much at all. I need to empty the container to transfer everything to another one so we'll see what sort of condition the car and parts are in. I do go up there every now and again to open up the doors and let the air in.

Dave
 
I am sorry to see this...

However, i sincerely hope that the important engine internals will have survived much better.
 
Had a chat with the storage company yesterday. The upshot of the conversation was that, while maintaining that there was nothing wrong with the container, and that the contract stated no responsibility on their part, they were prepared to make a 'contribution' towards putting the car right. We just have to see if we can come to an agreement just what sort of contribution that is. I expect to hear back from them by mid-next week. Things look reasonably promising at this point...
 
Re: Storage headaches/engine upgrade

So they did come through in the end. Made me an offer (without admitting liability) which I accepted just to get it over with. Not as much as I'd like but better than nothing,
So, what to do with a basically sound 3500 with a knackered engine? I've been quite envious of the recent modern engine threads on here so I thought it was time I gave it a go. The plan is to put together a car for the missus to drive to replace her aging Celica. She's always loved the Rovers but has gotten used to reasonable fuel economy with a few Toyotas behind her and the last time I tried to put her in a Rover, it broke down every time she drove it. So, I did a bit of searching for a good rwd conversion that would give ok economy and modern(ish) reliability without dropping the V8s power by too much. All the 4 pots I looked at had a distinct lack of torque so my quest for a 2l 4 cyl got stretched slightly and I wound up with this:

It's a Toyota 1JZ-GE, 2.5l 6 cyl twin cam with about 168bhp and 173 lb/ft. It came from a '94 Chaser and has a 4spd auto on the back. So far with 4 days work the V8 has come out and the 6 is in. It fits remarkably well. No major clearance issues other than trans cooler pipes and trans dipstick, easily fixed. I have made and tacked the engine mounts up, made a trans crossmember, fabricated a throttle linkage, modified the shifter, had some power steering hoses made and ordered a driveshaft. Still a fair bit to do of course, fuel lines and pump, coolant hoses, lots of wiring etc but it all looks very promising.

 
I always thought that the P6 should have been launched with a compact in-line six instead of a clumsy 4 cyl.

So, there you go, you 'll end up with an interesting, coherent and refined vehicle, shame about the non-Rover engine...
 
Wow, no messing about! What does that make it now, a Rovota? A Toyover?
Can/will you dismantle and rebuild the V8 you removed?
 
I don't think we get the Toyota Chaser here - having Googled it I don't see why.
Fairly anodyne but OK.
Perhaps it strays into Lexus territory, being RWD

John
 
Yes, progress is good when the missus goes away. The Chaser was a bland but well made car and the motor saw service in the Supra and Soarer, often with a turbo or two hanging off it and occasionally in 3litre guise.
However this week I am currently down in Wellington with a rental car that is slowly dying. Anyone out there happen th know anything about Nissan transmissions? :eek:
 
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