4HP22 for sale - would it be worth making a bid?

WarrenL

WarrenL

Active Member
Gents,

I know the ZF 4HP22 has been discussed at length around these parts, but right at this very moment I'm lacking the time required to trawl through the old threads and refamiliarise myself with all the details.

But here is a box for sale not far from me, and my question is, is it suitable to grab as the first step towards my eventual conversion? The starting price is sharp.

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motor ... 360735.htm

Cheers again,
Warren
 
Hello Warren,

Before you make a bid or decide to go down the ZF path, it might be a very good idea to have a chat to some transmission places, so you can get an idea of rebuild costs and parts availability. As an example, from what I understand locally, rebuilding the ZF will easily cost double what you would spend having similar done on a BW rebuilt. Reliability is another consideration, so see what feedback you receive.

Ron.
 
Got a quote for a rebuild by a reputable Christchurch firm last year, to rebuild a ZF4hp22 would be NZ$300.00 and to fit a new A cluch would be the cost of the part (about 100) if required.
I do know of a Sherpa V8 motor and box that was for sale.............about 600 bux for both as I recall, ex Ambulance but I had been keeping stumm about it :LOL:

Graeme
 
That looks good. On the face of it any 2WD box with cable control is a good start. As Ron says, you must assume that any 2nd hand auto box you buy will need a rebuild before use and the ZF is no exception. To go with this one you will ultimately need a Range Rover / Disco / LDV box from which to take the bell housing and engine end equipment - TQ Convertor, spacers, flex plate and crank bush - but also the valve block. The BMW is certain to have much higher change speeds than the LR boxes. Then the final discussion is the most difficult part of the whole job - how to drive the speedo! There's something sticking up vertically at the rear of the transmission which is likely to be a speedo drive. It could even be mechanical! If so then ingenuity will surely find a way! The default option is to fit an elctronic sensor to the prop and use either an early SD1 speedo head (non preferred - no trip meter) or use a yamkie box of tricks which converts the electronic pulses into a conventional speedo drive sat just behind the speedo. You ought also to ask the seller for a better photo of the rear of the box and to sell you the prop shaft from the car to go with it if possible. Then you'll be able to merge the two prop shafts if necessary. Also make sure that the seller gives you the dipstick and tube - even if they are wrong for the Rover you need to have a datum point to depart from. Does look to have a nice shallow sump, which is a major bonus.

Hope that helps

Chris
 
hi,
that is cheap enough for a rebuild, the bmw box gives no problems at all. the right years from the 3 and 5 series has the inhibitor switch, mechanical speedo drive and kickdown cable, so no worries.

ian
 
Thanks guys. Even though the finer details are hazy, the general principle of the right Rangie/Disco parts mated to the desired 2WD bits is well imprinted. I've always reckoned on buying two boxes, a Rangie one and something else for the rear end. This seemed like a good bet for the 2WD parts, but I'm also aware of the variations in the numerous 4HP22s lurking about, and here's where the Forum expertise comes in!

The ZF is a very desirable upgrade, as far as I'm concerned. The biggest drawback of P6B as a 21st century drive is the old BW slushie, so I'm looking forward to the ZF upgrade as an exciting future project.
 
ghce wrote,...
Got a quote for a rebuild by a reputable Christchurch firm last year, to rebuild a ZF4hp22 would be NZ$300.00
Click to expand...

Hello Graeme,

That seems extraordinarily cheap for a complete rebuild... :shock: New planetary gears, sun gear etc plus all the steels and friction plates, seal kit, all for $300?? Somehow I don't think so.

Ron.
 
According to the man who gave the price the ZF box was so good a design that there was little need for major replacment other than the A clutch which gives trouble and that it would mostly be a strip clean and rebuild.
Warren, this particular Auto Box repairer could supply all the 2wd drive bits required from his extremely extensive inventory of used boxes...and as for pricing this guy was extremely reasonablea and knowledgable. I may follow up on the V8 Sherpa box and engine and see if it is still available, what mostly put me off was what to do with a Sherpa V8 (1992) as I beleive they are a low compression motor.

Graeme
 
ghce wrote,...
According to the man who gave the price the ZF box was so good a design that there was little need for major replacment other than the A clutch which gives trouble and that it would mostly be a strip clean and rebuild.
Click to expand...

This being reference to costing NZ$300.

Hello Graeme,

Yes I was pretty sure that would not have been for the full monty. Over on the Land Rover forum, they talk about big $$$$ when discussing rebuilds of the ZF, and A$2750 was mentioned as being what one owner paid. Mind you that may well have included removal and refit, but still it is going to be much more expensive an exercise than doing the same with a BW. Of course longevity has to be considered, and the consensus there is 200,000 to 300,000km will see one out.

Ron.
 
Clearly it's necessary to start with a good box. Brown Rover will never wear one out at the mileage I cover, but that's assuming I don't start off with a box freshly plucked from a 300,000 km banger. My aim was to try for a good low-medium mileage box from a broken LR/RR and have it decently serviced and overhauled. A candidate for a complete rebuild is not a candidate for purchase.

My mechanic pal does auto transmission service and rebuilds, so I may just let this one go and ask him to find me the right parts when the time comes. Otherwise, if you don't want that Sherpa setup I might be interested, Graeme. Money's a bit tight right now (the paint bill's going to deal to the Rover fund for a good while) but if it's worthwhile I'll hit the wife up for her loose change. If it's a good 'un it'll be worth shoving into a corner of the garage until further notice, and I could give the engine to Ben so that he can have a crack at getting White Rover mobile again.
 
Accordint to the chap selling it the box was getting tired and was not changing correctly when cold
 
Hmmm. The Sherpa box is the certainly the best candidate, and they're hard to come by in this part of the world.

Would the pain of paying out to have a tired Sherpa box more comprehensively overhauled be worth it when compared with the stress of stitching together the required bits out of RR/BMW boxes? Next time I'm talking to John I'll find out what he thinks about rebuilding ZFs, and the likely cost. I'm determined to proceed with this project at some point in the not-too-distant future, so it's worth doing some digging now.
 
Would need to look at all the features the sherpa box offers asuch as lockup point and speedo drive also wheather mechanical or electric change
 
Thats the kind of good news I need to hear
However it is my understanding that only the electric boxes have lockup in 3rd and 4th and the mechanicals 4th only
 
Even if you're right on that Graeme, lock-up only in 4th gear is still a grand improvement on no lock-up, no 4th gear.
 
I'm 95% sure lock up is on both 3rd and top. It's a ZF design characteristic across all their boxes, so I'd be very surprised if it didn't apply to the cable HP22. Just need one in working order to go out and try now....

Chris
 
I can't recall if anybody here has actually done a ZF transplant. If so, we need him/her to pipe up about now.
 
Hello Warren,

I am aware from having discussed fitting a ZF into a 3500 with another Rover owner that the tunnel will need cutting open and remodelling. He (the owner of the 3500) had acquired the box but as it stood it was not going to fit.

Ron.
 
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