1972 Rover P5B

F

FrazzleTC

Active Member
As I posted elsewhere on the forum about a month ago, I've fulfilled my dream of owning a Rover P5B. However, the car is insured as a modern car, and my insurance company contacted me shortly after the policy was paid, to say that they had made a mistake, and thought it was a P6B, and as a result, they expected me to pay an increased premium. I objected, saying that my documents clearly stated that it was a P5B, with my car's registration. In the end, they agreed to maintain my cover at the same price, BUT my excess is £2000! :shock: As a result, I've tried, with no success to insure the car all over the place, and yes, I really have tried everywhere! I wouldn't advertise my dream car for sale unless absolutely essential! Needless to say, I'm absolutely devastated. I'd consider a P/X of something 2.0 or less.
The advert:
For sale.
1972 Rover P5B saloon in Zircon Blue, buckskin leather, with a full webasto sunroof, which is absolutely superb on a sunny day, and completely leak-free!
The history file for the car is absolutely enormous, with correspondence between all of the owners, one of those being Sir Christopher Leaver, a former Lord Mayor of London. It has had a full engine rebuild, with receipts to back this up, not very long ago! The interior is absolutely delightful, with the leather having a lovely clean look, but enough patina that it looks a genuinely cherished car! The woodwork, unfortunately is cracked. Rather interestingly, it's all walnut, which looks to have been fitted to a very high standard, but hasn't aged as well as one would hope!
The wheels are in good condition, and the tyres have plenty of tread. There is a full PD Gough stainless steel exhaust system fitted to the car as well. It's had new brake pipes fitted on my watch, as documented on this forum. There appears to have been regular maintenance carried out on the car by its owners, with thousands of pounds-worth of receipts from JR Wadhams, and other well-known parts suppliers! The car had a very expensive restoration in the 80s, with new wings, door bottoms, a full respray, and a lot of rechroming! The bumpers aren't totally straight, but the chrome is pretty good! There's a radiomobile radio fitted to the car, and the rear heater works well.
There are quite a few spares with the car, including a full set of new hoses, with receipts, two rechromed numberplate surrounds, and several other smalls bits and pieces in new packaging too!
Bodily, the car looks absolutely brilliant. It presents itself very well indeed, with only one area requiring attention in the near future, at the bottom of the driver's side front wing. The sills are perfect, to the best of my knowledge, and having had quotes for a rusty P5, I know how important this is. I wouldn't have bought it unless it had been a very good one!
So, to summarise, a very nice, useable P5B with exceptional provenance, which looks very smart indeed!
As a result, I'm looking for offers in the region of £4250, but I'm very open to offers, and I'm most insistant that the car goes to a good home, and ideally, I'd like the opportunity to potentially buy the car back in the future, once I'm older. I know it's a cliché, but I have an absolutely genuine reason for sale, because, in short, continuing to insure it for the future, is going to be impossible.
I'd consider a P/X of something which is 2.0 or smaller, something like an MGB or another Rover/Triumph 2000, but let me know what you think, and I'll happily discuss the car with you!
PM me for any further information on the car.
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TBH, I can't see why a P5B would be more expensive to insure than a P6B. I imagine the P6 would have the edge on speed though I don't suppose there would be too much in it. The P5 in comparable condition would have the edge value-wise, but even so. All I've ever paid to add a car to my policy is a nominal fee of around £30, whether 2000 or 3500 though my P5B was the car on which the policy was originally taken out.
Your car looks very nice, the walnut is unusual.
 
Sorry to hear that fraser.

On a realistic point. the car is insured as an everday car so there is no agreed value. You would be horrefied to know what insurance company would pay you out in the event of a claim. The market value is not a great sum or even what you would expect. The P5 is a better option that the p6 in this situation as you can use like for like adverts and the p5 is always going to be more expensive. if the car is valued at £4500 then they would pay out £2500.

You only need to pay an excess if you claim, if you bump the car the insurance pay the third party at no cost to you and you can fix any damaged yourself for a lot less than a £2000 excess. So it isnt that bad, just a scary worry for you.

Being a young guy I know what you are going through. If you like the P5 the keep it and dont crash.

Good luck with the sale or if you keep it. I have a Coupé and will hopefully never sell.

Colin
 
Sorry to hear that the car has to go because of the insurance, it really is a nice looking car. My apologies if I have missed it somewhere but have you not looked a specific classic car insurance policy? Im only 33 and I had an unlimited mileage classic insurance quote on my P6 3500 for £124 fully comp with a £50 excess, my NCB is not included because thats on my main car and that also includes full UK and European breakdown; I appreciate we are all different and quotes can vary wildly but there must be a sensible quote out there somewhere.
 
Fraser,

I am truly saddened to hear that you might have to give up this lovely motor - at the risk of sounding like an old fart... do what you can to keep the P5B, I can tell you from experience that I missed many an oppertunity to own my dream car(s) when I was younger, I am sure that there are others that will tell you the same. Keep looking, don't give up - I am sure there is a way for you to keep the P5B, you managed somehow with your TC, you can do it again. If you want to send it for a peaceful retirement in the sunshine, feel free to put it on a boat to California - I promise to take care of it for you :D
 
I'm really bemused by your difficulties with insurance, Fraser. I know at least a couple of people in their low 20's who have not had a problem getting Classic insurance. It's very common then to be be able to have multiple cars on the same policy at virtually no extra charge. Mine even has unlimited mileage! Granted at, your age, it won't be as cheap as mine, but it ought to be affordable. Do you understand why exactly you can't get Classic insurance?

I'm sure the correct way forward is to tackle the insurance issue rather than sell the car. It sounds to me as if it will be well worth you paying coin of the realm to an "expert" / "consultant" to try to tease out what is really going on. Is the problem your propensity to travelling by breakdown truck? I could imagine that counting as a claim?

Chris
 
Sell in haste and regret at your leisure! I am certain there is an affordable solution to your current quandry. Even sticking it in storageis preferable to it's sale as in years to come you may well find you will have less and less chance to afford a repurchase and that those cars that are available at low price will be dogs.

Graeme
 
In this months classics monthly (i think it was that one not practical classics) there's a whole page of letters from youngsters in exactly this position. Including one from Fraser i think. The companys have decided they dont want the business to my mind.

Rich
 
Possibly some young drivers are trying to avoid extortionate modern car insurance by running classics instead. With their statistically higher claim rate, maybe the insurance companies have seen a big increase in classic insurance claims, and decided they're better off dropping this section of customers.

I suppose it keeps the policies cheaper for us old farts.

This brings us back to the whole young driver insurance issue, at the moment costs are so high that they're being forced off the road, or running without insurance, or trying every trick to avoid paying the high rates. I don't have a solution, if young drivers are so dangerous then maybe we should raise the driving age to 21. Neither of my eldest lads (20 and 22) can afford to have a car, and I feel sorry for them, thinking back to how car ownership changed my life at 17/18.
 
This brings us back to the whole young driver insurance issue, at the moment costs are so high that they're being forced off the road, or running without insurance, or trying every trick to avoid paying the high rates. I don't have a solution, if young drivers are so dangerous then maybe we should raise the driving age to 21. Neither of my eldest lads (20 and 22) can afford to have a car, and I feel sorry for them, thinking back to how car ownership changed my life at 17/18.
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I think the age band would just move up from 17 to 21.

i think there should be regulation of the insurance market, and that premiums should be forcibly advertised as a statistical percentage of the cost of accidents/claims or something of that nature. It would lay the companies bare and show them for what they are. (I dont believe them if you cant guess!)

Rich
 
Why can't they adopt a fairer system, so first insurance for a younger driver is reasonable lets say £500. Now after the first year with no claims the premium stays the same, if they have an accident then the premium is heavily increased, not every young driver is racing around the streets but they are all treated the same. I'm sorry but insurance is one massive rip off. If anyone is caught driving with no insurance, take away the car as they do, fine them heavily not £5 a week for 5 years and get the money from going into their homes and removing their TV sets, computers, PS3 etc make them realise it's not worth it.
 
chrisyork said:
I'm really bemused by your difficulties with insurance, Fraser. I know at least a couple of people in their low 20's who have not had a problem getting Classic insurance. It's very common then to be be able to have multiple cars on the same policy at virtually no extra charge. Mine even has unlimited mileage! Granted at, your age, it won't be as cheap as mine, but it ought to be affordable. Do you understand why exactly you can't get Classic insurance?

I'm sure the correct way forward is to tackle the insurance issue rather than sell the car. It sounds to me as if it will be well worth you paying coin of the realm to an "expert" / "consultant" to try to tease out what is really going on. Is the problem your propensity to travelling by breakdown truck? I could imagine that counting as a claim?

Chris
Click to expand...

The problem is, that the industry has implemented some very big changes to their system since I started classic ownership. For anyone over the age of 25, classic insurance remains an absolute bargain, but, they clearly couldn't care less for their younger customers. As I see it, a lot of people my age were paying £800 or so with classic insurers, until everything changed, and even at that, as a percentage of the insurers' incomes, it would be a reasonable amount, as most older people pay around £150 a year to insure all manner of classics!
Basically, there will soon be absolutely no young enthusiasts, with good reason too, given the fact that they have to go to unbelievable lengths to insure any car over 20 years old! Deeply sad, but it's true.
 
It is sad to read this, by us in Holland you pay about 30 Euro in a year assurance for a car older than 25 year and the tax complete free thats make interesting to drive on gas what normal for a modern car 2 or 3 times more tax than a petrol car .
But if you can keep it i prefer that have you in GB not a special classic assurance, i have it from Dutch:ANWB i think you have AA??? or not??
 
I'd look at a laid up policy till you sort something.
I know a young lad with a higher value car in the same predicament, covered for about 70 quid :)
Once it's gone it's gone :cry:
Bearing in mind I'm a whisper over 25 :oops: I'd remind folk if they would have found it easy to insure any vehicle with a V8 3.5 litre back in the day at Frazzles age, things have only gotten worse IMO regards insurance. That was when they were current common cars too :| I know I only managed it due to motortrade cover.
I'd still really look into every option before parting with such a nice looking motor :(
 
Just a quick note to say, that if anyone is interested in the 2000, then it could potentially be sold, allowing the P5B to stay.
 
It's not just the younger guys either. I had a series 1 Jaguar XJ6 insured with Footman James - and before that a variety of P6/P6Bs - and they were fine for quite a few years. Then I bought the E-type a year ago, and although they had no problem removing the XJ6 and adding the E mid-period, when it came up for renewal, they said that they could no longer cover me.

I'm 36, have been driving in NZ since 15, in the UK since 25.. but they said that the E is worth too much for someone my age to insure, especially with the V12, as they assumed that sooner or later I'd end up with a piece of expensive scrap metal due to excessive speeds. A load of complete cr*p as I have once had the car to 85MPH - when a truck tried to squash me on the M27 - but apart from that, I keep it between 35-45MPH and avoid the motorways. If I have to hit the motorway, I sit on the inside lane at 50MPH. If I want to drive fast, I'll do it in something 40 years newer 8)

The insurance companies just don't care.. it's all about the odds on paying out and making money for them.
 
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