Rockershaft issue.

#21
Hi Stefan

I know this thread is almost 4 years old but it's extremely interesting. I am planning on shamelessly copying your idea and was wondering if you could report on your long term experiences? Any drawings would be amazing but now I think I am being greedy.

kind regards

Fred
 

jp928

Well-Known Member
#22
I am also interested in a long term report please. I am surprised that the shafts wear this much - usually a soft element and a hard item dont wear badly compared to soft-on-soft or hard-on-hard. Maybe the alloy is not well chosen? I guess its down to a lack of lubrication, especially in the early engines. In the 80s a I ran 2 SD1 manuals to 100k miles without any tappet issues and the interior of the heads was wet and spotless. The 74 S I am about to buy has dry rocker cover insides, so the state of the rockers will be one of the first inspections, and exploring why the oil supply is poor.
 

SydneyRoverP6B

Well-Known Member
Staff member
#23
The rocker shafts that were in my Rover's original 10.5:1 engine were made from steel. The undersides had from memory next to no wear evident when I replaced them during the mid 1990s. Mileage wise, probably around 150,000 covered at that time.

The insides of the original engine were also dirty, gritty dirt being evident on the inside surface of the rocker covers and elsewhere. I changed the oil every 2000 miles or so, but I suspect it made only a slight difference to the cleanliness. Contrast my 4.6, now with almost 200,000 miles covered since 2007, looking into the rocker covers, the shafts, pushrods, indeed everything that you can see is still silver! There is no gritty dirt anywhere to be seen. The flame traps don't clog with dirt like those on the 3.5, only a little oil accumulates. Degrease and reuse, no problems at all. I do the same as with the original engine, change the oil every 2000 miles or so.

Ron.
 

jp928

Well-Known Member
#24
Ron,
As reported elsewhere I ran 2 SD1 5 speeds to 100k mi, and their insides were clean and shiny at the end. Having seen some older engines in the same condition you report, I felt that the SD1 version was better due to improved oil supply to the rockers. The 74 I am looking at has at least one dry rocker cover, but the condition of the shafts etc is unknown.
Have you come to any conclusion on why the later motors fare better in the rocker area?
thanks
 

SydneyRoverP6B

Well-Known Member
Staff member
#25
Ron,
As reported elsewhere I ran 2 SD1 5 speeds to 100k mi, and their insides were clean and shiny at the end. Having seen some older engines in the same condition you report, I felt that the SD1 version was better due to improved oil supply to the rockers. The 74 I am looking at has at least one dry rocker cover, but the condition of the shafts etc is unknown.
Have you come to any conclusion on why the later motors fare better in the rocker area?
thanks
Hi JP,

I had read that the outer row of 4 cylinder head bolts were responsible for applying a rotational torque, allowing exhaust gases to enter the lifter gallery. This certainly would explain the dry dirt that so many engines suffer from, and why oil galleries especially those flowing to the rockers should end up being starved of oil.

What that hypothesis does not explain though is why your SD1 and other engines should remain clean, given they too (I presume here) were fitted with 14 bolt cylinder heads. The other possible explanation is that the rotational torque applied to the heads was much less of a problem that had been surmised, and that the running in process that the engines received in the factory, and that was continued by the car's first owner was, a much bigger problem.

Ron
 

clive P62

Active Member
#26
When I wanted a SD1 engine for my p6 in the mid / late 80s the rover centre in London had skips full of them and could take my pick.
Most of them were badly coked up inside like P6s.
 

jp928

Well-Known Member
#27
Do we know much about the factory running process back then? Even back then I was aware of stuff like no extreme loads, and no long periods at same throttle settings.
 

SydneyRoverP6B

Well-Known Member
Staff member
#28
Do we know much about the factory running process back then? Even back then I was aware of stuff like no extreme loads, and no long periods at same throttle settings.
I have never seen any information JP on the procedure to run the engines in within the factory. I imagine that it was just running the camshafts in for 10 or 15 minutes and nothing more.

I have the 'Under Warranty' booklets that came with my Rover when my late father purchased the car in 1978. The car's only owner prior to my father put just a tad over 20,000 miles (32,200km) on the car in 4 years. The first 12 months or 12,000 miles (20,000km) being under warranty. Pretty normal for cars at that time. The first service was at 1000km, then 5000km, 10,000km, 15,000km, and finally 20,000km. The first owner took longer to cover these distances, but continued to have the car serviced by the Rover dealer from which it was purchased. There is no mention in the booklet as to how the car is to be driven during this time.

Ron.
 
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#30
Hi all,

For those interested I am going to start a fresh thread regarding re-bushing rover V8 rockers in a similar manner to how the ones at the start of this thread were done. I’ll see it through to the end and hopefully be able to make a few units for people who are interested if the price works out.
 

jp928

Well-Known Member
#34
Much as I like the idea of bushed rockers etc, if you replace the shafts and rockers now (even after market rockers) you will probably NEVER wear them out in your lifetime. Applaud all those who improve this area, but the economics are poor, but doubtless you will enjoy the exercise. I once suggested replacing the clutch throwout bearing in a P4 style gearbox with an angular contact type, to be told 'What, so it will last 100 years, instead of just 50?'.
 
#35
self satisfaction can often override economic logic being a maintenance engineer I have seen the shortcomings of aluminium and aluminium bronze bearings .The 3500 V8 can do with all the upgrades it can
 
#37
It was the quality of the replacement rockers that appalled me as much as the wear in older items. To be honest some of the replacements are as bad as 30 year old ones. it’s quite astounding how much noise the rockers create because of their lateral play and when I first started mine up with the re-bushed rockers I was amazed at the difference. It’s a noise most v8 owners just consider normal.
 

mrtask

Well-Known Member
#38
@Freddurrant How have you been getting on with your self made set-up? I would be interested to hear your impressions. May I ask if you sold any sets to other Rover owners from this forum?
@Robste Do keep us posted as you progress with your endeavour. Watching with interest!
 

jp928

Well-Known Member
#39
When I got my car it was a bit rattly, but not terrible. Pulled the rockers of and found the shafts as below. Speedo showing 14k , so probably 214k kms.



I rebuilt them with shafts and rockers from Island 4x4 (obviously not genuines!) , and am very happy - almost total silence, after a couple of oil changes. Maybe a slight tick from one lifter.
 
#40
@Freddurrant How have you been getting on with your self made set-up? I would be interested to hear your impressions. May I ask if you sold any sets to other Rover owners from this forum?
@Robste Do keep us posted as you progress with your endeavour. Watching with interest!
I’m 100% pleased with the result. They take a bit of time to construct and are never going to make me much money due to the cost of manufacture. I have indeed sold a couple of sets, the first went all the way to New Zealand.
 
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