Rockershaft issue.

#1
Hello!

When I rebuilt my engine last winter I was quite suprised about the non-ideal construction of the whole rocker assambly. The idea of having cast aluminum rockers rubbig against the Steel shaft is as many of you probably already know no good at all. Probably very cheep to manufacture but that is its only avantage. The problem became even more of a problem when the suplie of original Rover rocker shaft is drying up and the shafts and rockers i got hold of became noisy after less then 500 km. Anyway, when some thorough googeling couldn't help me i dessided to make my own rocker shafts and mount some bronze bushing in the original rocker arms.

The Shaft is 20 mm H7 polished steel shaft, cant remember what type of steel right know but is hard enough (170 HB i think)
The bearings is FB-092-20 bronze bushing, which sould last longer then the engine, one of the avantages whit bronze bushing is that they dont need much lubrication which means I can reduce the amount of oil to the rocker assambly and mayby get an increase in oil pressure :)

The whole thing should be ready in two to four weeks, the hardest thing was to drill through the rocker shaft and whit that problem out of the way is should be downhill the rest of the way.

Regards
/Stefan
 

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harveyp6

Well-Known Member
#2
That looks good. The replacement parts available seem to be of very low quality for the most part, and what you're doing there should improve things. It's something I've often thought about doing, but like a lot of things, never got around to actually doing it.
 
#3
That looks good. The replacement parts available seem to be of very low quality for the most part, and what you're doing there should improve things. It's something I've often thought about doing, but like a lot of things, never got around to actually doing it.
Thanks Harvey.

Yes I noticed that as well, it seems like almos everyone have the same low quality rocker shaft for sale. I found two NOS Land Rover shafts but they were £300 a pice.
Noise rocker arms makes my skinn cralw, specially on a recently rebuilt engine so I felt that it was beter to do it at once instead of driving around and getting irritated all the time.
 

GRTV8

Well-Known Member
#4
one of the avantages whit bronze bushing is that they dont need much lubrication which means I can reduce the amount of oil to the rocker assambly and mayby get an increase in oil pressure :)
Why would you do that ? Heaps of Oil to the top must be a good thing . At least it just keeps things clean and quiet . If you've got oil pressure issues ,why not put the larger SD1 oil pump on while you've got her down to her undies.
 
#5
Why would you do that ? Heaps of Oil to the top must be a good thing . At least it just keeps things clean and quiet . If you've got oil pressure issues ,why not put the larger SD1 oil pump on while you've got her down to her undies.
Hello GRTV8

Well, the new bronze bushing don´t need a lot of oil and I think that oil could be used somwere else, like the main bearings. Also regardig to Des Hammill´s book "how to power tune Rover V8 engines" the whole
rocker assambly is over lubicated and only a small reduction in oil to the rocker assambly will give a incresse in oil presure on all engine speeds. I alredy have the SD1 oil pump and a oil pressure of
about 9-10 psi per 1000 rpm and around 40-45 psi at 4500 rpm, so no oil pressure problem :) But would like to have a pressure around 15 psi when idling, alot of red lights and slow traffic where I live...
I probably construct some type of vale/adjusting thing in the first rocker shaft pedestal and thus will be enable to adjust the amount of oil to the rockers. So if the flow to the rockers is insufficient I will be able to incresse it.

/Stefan
 

rockdemon

Administrator
Staff member
#6
that looks really impressive. A bit beyond my means but something i'd love to be able to buy ready made without spending a fortune.
 

clive P62

Active Member
#7
Just a note on rocker shafts wearing after repairing,some owners make the mistake of only changing shafts.
If you do this they will wear very fast due to the worn shaft particals embedded into soft alloy rockers then these wear shafts again.
Might be worth checking real steel for shafts/rockers as some years ago i fitted new shafts with steel non adjustable rockers.
Oh just make sure shafts are fitted correct way up or you wont get any oil up, see workshop manual for info.
Clive.
 
#8
that looks really impressive. A bit beyond my means but something i'd love to be able to buy ready made without spending a fortune.
Thank you, I work as a CNC technician/operator at a small mechanical workshop and is fortune
enough to have access to both 3 and 5-axis CNC mills and both manual and 3-axis CNC lathes so things that is imposible to manufacture in ones own garage is quite easy for me to do at work.
I actullay did some thinking about doing a small series of complete rocker assamblyies and sell but the would have been quite expensive.
The problem is the rocker skaft, it need´s to be A. a very hard and polished material which is difficult and time consuming to drill and need´s special drills which are rater expensive or B. a soft material which need´s hardening and
grinding after drilling which also increes the price :/

/Stefan
 
#11
Just a note on rocker shafts wearing after repairing,some owners make the mistake of only changing shafts.
If you do this they will wear very fast due to the worn shaft particals embedded into soft alloy rockers then these wear shafts again.
Might be worth checking real steel for shafts/rockers as some years ago i fitted new shafts with steel non adjustable rockers.
Oh just make sure shafts are fitted correct way up or you wont get any oil up, see workshop manual for info.
Clive.
Hello Clive.

Both shaft and rocker are brand new, not steel rockers but aluminum. It is possible that Reel steels rockers are better, I bought my from rilmmerbros and the quality
leaves something to be desired. The main problem is that the shaft, is realy not hard enough, it is some softer steel whit a hard surface treatment which sems to wear of easily,
and the fit betwen shaft and rocker is quite slopy and not consistent, some rockers fit tight and nice other are very loose. Thats no problem, there is oil everywhere! If I run the engine whitout
rocker covers one might think I fond a oil well!

/Stefan
 
#12
Why don't you do some calculations as to what the various bits would cost you to make and post them on here?
You may be surprised.
Hello John.

A very rough estimate, using cheep aftermarket rockers, will put the price for 16 rockers with bronze bushings, 8 rocker shaft pedestals and 2 rocker shafts somewhere between 350 to 450 USD
But before I sell any parts to anyone I neet to properly road test the new parts. At least drive a thousnad miles then disassemble the whole thing and look for wear etc. So mayby I can make and sell a few
modified rocker assamblies if anyone is interested, but not right now. What I can do almost right now is upload the drawings of the parts I made if you are interested?

/Stefan
 

unstable load

Well-Known Member
#13
That is a good idea to test the ones you made first. My car seems to be OK for now, but as it's off the road, that is a moot point...
Putting the drawings up is an alternative, I am sure there are those who have the ability to make their own and could benefit from that.
 
#15
New update!

One of the rocker shaft assemblies is now complete and the other one only needs the rockers drilled to 22.980 mm and the bronze bushings presed in and it will be ready too. The car also passed
its MOT or "besiktiningen" as it it called here in Sweden last monday :)

Regarding selling some rocker shaft assemblies... There might be a very small possibility that I can make a small batch (around five complete assemblies) sometime around Chrismas but it is to early to
know for sure yet.

I also made a video of the engine runing whit its valve covers off whit its "old" rocker shaft, the nasty knocking sounds comes from the rocker whit the blue line on it and almost all the ratteling is from other rockers :/
All the components are new and have done less than a 1000 km.


Best Regards
/Stefan
 
#16
And they are all done! :D

After spending three days in bed after my now former desntist screwd up I was finally abel to complete both rocker shaft assemblies yesterday and I must say there is qute the difference. The rocker are almost dead silent
and the engine seems to run a bit smoother as well (may also be that is is starting to gett properly broken in...). The distrubitor gear still make some unwanted nois but that will be somthing I will deal whit during the winter.
One thing thing that I didnt like was the state of the "old" rocker shaft, it was quite worn considering how few km it hade done. The wear was quite notabe on most contact areas betwen rocker and shaft.
Anyway some picture an a video :)


Regards
/Stefan
 

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rockdemon

Administrator
Staff member
#18
That's really impressive. Only one question, There is obviously very little oil at the top of the engine now. Is there enough to lubricate the moving parts we can see? Just i know on mine there's quite a lot of oil that comes out of the rocker shafts - half running onto the pushrods and half going down through the heads. Is this a bad thing on mine, and also would too little oil lead to premature failure of the pushrods etc?
 
#19
That's really impressive. Only one question, There is obviously very little oil at the top of the engine now. Is there enough to lubricate the moving parts we can see? Just i know on mine there's quite a lot of oil that comes out of the rocker shafts - half running onto the pushrods and half going down through the heads. Is this a bad thing on mine, and also would too little oil lead to premature failure of the pushrods etc?
Thank you :) I acctualy hade the same concern regardig the lack of oil to the puchrods, but the is a oil passage through the rocker to the top of the pushrod and that one still works sending fresh oil to the pushrod so I think the pusrods will be fine. And the is still some oil (about 1/3 the amout of the old rocker assambly) spouting out betwen the rockers and the skaft so it is not runing completly dry. Of course, I cant be 100% certian everything works fine until I driven ha few 1000 km. I going on an road trip early august and the plan is to dissasambly both rocker assamblies after the trip to look for wear and damage.
 
#20
Now that is much nicer, running like a sewing machine!!
Can't wait too see your next upgrade.


Graeme
Thanks alot Graeme :)

To my suprise it is even quieter on the move, I took the Rover to work yestarday and driving home doing about 100-110 km/h, 62-68 mph on the higway I could not hear the engine, only wind and some tire nois.
I almost thought it had cut out and died for a moment... The nex thing is to get it to a rolling road and then it is time for new springs and shock absorbers, so noting as special as "the rocker prodject"
in the nearest future, unfortunately.

/Stefan
 
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