Improved performance - 2000tc

I had been thinking the last few days of putting a Mitsubishi GTO engine in a p6 as picking up 2nd hand GTO's in NZ is very cheap and a 320HP engine (with a huge amount of replumbing to fit it) would scare the bejesus out of any one you are likely to meet on the open road or even track, I think there would be some matching Mitsi rear wheel drive gearbox that will do the job....... just a thought form an idle day dream, 1300 KG 320 HP wacth out captain Kirk we are in warp drive!

Graeme
 
I was planning on using the Montego engine, as it probably won't look too out of place in the engine bay of a p6. As I add and change the car, I'm trying to make sure that the modifications are as unoticed as possible. Its all to easy to fall into the same pitfalls as the Saxo Brigade.
 
Fraserp6 said:
I was planning on using the Montego engine, as it probably won't look too out of place in the engine bay of a p6. As I add and change the car, I'm trying to make sure that the modifications are as unoticed as possible. Its all to easy to fall into the same pitfalls as the Saxo Brigade.
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Most well thought out and engineered modifications are almost completely un-noticeable to most people, but then it's all down to the desired result that you want from them. An engine change done well should always look right at home when finished. Also depends whether you permanently modify the vehicle or just keep everything 'bolt on' so they could always be reversed if you ever have a change of mind.

To fall into the same category as the 'Saxo Brigade' you've really got to be trying some :LOL:
 
ghce said:
I had been thinking the last few days of putting a Mitsubishi GTO engine in a p6 as picking up 2nd hand GTO's in NZ is very cheap and a 320HP engine (with a huge amount of replumbing to fit it) would scare the bejesus out of any one you are likely to meet on the open road or even track, I think there would be some matching Mitsi rear wheel drive gearbox that will do the job....... just a thought form an idle day dream, 1300 KG 320 HP wacth out captain Kirk we are in warp drive!

Graeme
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Don't use a Mitsubishi box, there's nothing wrong with their engines. The GTO and FTO (+ other ) manual transmissions have a "mystery" problem where they spin their bearings inside the gearbox casings; this trashes the casings and makes for a mucho-dollar repair

Granted; some never do this, but I sold these both new and used in Tokyo and it was scary how many were subject to warranty claims because this happened. Permanently tarnished the image of the cars in Japan, which was a shame, as they are a classic, and sparked a recall scandal that became a media circus that showed up how many other Mits.faults were occuring and being hidden, or denied, by the dealers

I sold the very last GTO ever made; in 1999, which went to Singapore. Red, it was completely unoptioned, right down to a radio-delete and steel wheels. to save our customer import taxes

GW
 
DaveHerns said:
Has anyone tried a supercharger ?
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not personally, this Buick 215 was on Ebay USA a few months back; went around a couple of times for $10K but didn't field a bid, if I had to guess its a GMC 671 blower on a Weiand manifold
From shopping around for Superchargers, the Ozzie "YellaTerra" was a good deal, but the AUS$ has firmed quite a bit in the last few months; about AUS$6K from memory and you would need to fabricate a manifold ( by cutting up an Edelbrock or Offenhauser ) and add carbs, as well as make a crank pulley to run the belt
Definitely need forged pistons in a motor like this

Buick4.jpg

Buick3.jpg

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Buick1.jpg


GW
 
TokyoP6B said:
Don't use a Mitsubishi box, there's nothing wrong with their engines. The GTO and FTO (+ other ) manual transmissions have a "mystery" problem where they spin their bearings inside the gearbox casings; this trashes the casings and makes for a mucho-dollar repair

Granted; some never do this, but I sold these both new and used in Tokyo and it was scary how many were subject to warranty claims because this happened. Permanently tarnished the image of the cars in Japan, which was a shame, as they are a classic, and sparked a recall scandal that became a media circus that showed up how many other Mits.faults were occuring and being hidden, or denied, by the dealers

I sold the very last GTO ever made; in 1999, which went to Singapore. Red, it was completely unoptioned, right down to a radio-delete and steel wheels. to save our customer import taxes

GW
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Darn German engineering :LOL: Getrag gearboxs arnt all they are cracked up to be :roll:

Graeme
 
Hi folks,

Thought I'd resurrect this old thread and see if there was any more opinions.
I have a rather tired 2200TC that is in need of a refresh and I'm wondering if there are any engine improvements that can be made. Nothing as fancy as EFI nor turbos, just good old fashioned NA tuning.

I'm presuming a good port and mild polish can help.
Bigger valves or are they about as big as they go from factory?
Can the exhaust manifold be improved upon?
Larger bore, free flow exhaust?
Lightened flywheel?
Cam options? I remember seeing an article suggesting hot Vauxhall cams could be swapped in?
Obviously the engine could benefit from being dynamically balanced.

I guess one thing I've always wondered is what makes the 2000TC 130ish bhp and the 2200TC only 115ish? Can earlier parts be used to bring the 2200TC up to earlier performance levels. I understand the 2200 had significantly increased torque, but still...
 
GJM said:
Hi folks,

Thought I'd resurrect this old thread and see if there was any more opinions.
I have

I guess one thing I've always wondered is what makes the 2000TC 130ish bhp and the 2200TC only 115ish? Can earlier parts be used to bring the 2200TC up to earlier performance levels. I understand the 2200 had significantly increased torque, but still...
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I have a feeling that the power figures for the 2000 was a test bed (SAE) number and the 2200 installed (DIN) , so not directly comparable.
 
ive spent a lot of years tuning a lot of different engine, but never a p6 4 cyl, so my advise is based on experience and gut feeling, not proven gains.

the tc exhaust manifold is a decent design, i dont think youd gain much from changing it unless you fit a fairly wild cam. speaking of cam im unaware of anything else which will fit, but im sure someone like newman cams could reprofile it into something a bit more lively, dont go mad though it not a very revy engine partly due to the very heavy piston design. a bit of head work helps any engine, bigger valves would probably be tricky to sort and need bigger inserts in the head, so stick to standard ones, but 3 angle the seats. if you can loosing a few lbs off the flywheel will be good
 
I guess that would make sense re the power figure roverp480. Heard somewhere it was down to more emissions equipment on the later 2200 but I ask myself... what emissions equipment???

And that all makes sense Penguin. I'd be interested to talk to Kentcams or someone like Newman to see what could be done. Otherwise it just sounds like a bit of basic head work and fettling here and there. I think I few bhp could be freed up thought :)
 
The high horsepower early 2000TCs had 10:1 compression pistons. Since the combustion chamber in Heron head designs is formed by the piston you'd have to get a larger 2200 bore piston with the high compression shape. These aren't and never have been available and custom making/machining them is extremely expensive.
Don't forget that the 2000TC motor had a very high output per litre for a non turbo, non fuel injected two valve per cylinder production engine. Other than 2.0 litre motors produced by Ferrari and Lamborghini or Porsche, I can't think of a higher power 2 valve carbed motor made by anyone else at the time with more power.
But refinement, (and low down torque) is another matter.
 
I remember at work ( Austin Factory Longbridge) , our manager had a 2000TC as his company car when BL emerged. He also had free petrol from pumps onsite but Longbridge only had 2 and 4 star. The Rover TC needed 5 star so he had the workshop swap out the pistons to the lower CR export ones so he could keep his free petrol. I am sure they were never put back before the car sold on to the trade.
 
roverp480 said:
I remember at work ( Austin Factory Longbridge) , our manager had a 2000TC as his company car when BL emerged. He also had free petrol from pumps onsite but Longbridge only had 2 and 4 star. The Rover TC needed 5 star so he had the workshop swap out the pistons to the lower CR export ones so he could keep his free petrol. I am sure they were never put back before the car sold on to the trade.
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I am in NZ. My first (1969) 2000TC had 'export spec' 9.0:1 pistons, my later NADA TC was 10:1 and noticeably faster if running on 100 octane, which was hard to get.
 
I went up to 2200cc with 9:1 pistons replacing the 10:1 2000TC pistons on my car. Power felt about the same on the HS8 carbs. I later went for HIF6 carbs and they really help with mid range responsiveness and torque. Change was made due to lack of high octane fuel in NJ.
 
makes sense, an extra 200cc would go a long way to offset the loss of compression, not surprised on the carb front either, there no way a 4 cyl p6 actually needs the airflow capabilities of a pair of 2 inch carbs
 
I did notice she's not quite as happy at high revs as before, but general drivablity is improved.
 
Just to add to this thread (bring back from the dead?). I can recommend the Piper fast road cam as an upgrade. It gives a nice bump in torque above 3500rpm, but without sacrificing the idle smoothness. In fact, I'd say its smoother now, but that might be because of the work put into the head at the same time.
 
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