Government MOT exempt discussion forum

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RoverAlex

Active Member
#4
I think there are some good points about it - you'd have thought that the majority of those running an older car would be enthusiasts, would look after there car and so on which I can agree with to an extent. But I think it's a bad idea in general and can think of lots of examples. Let's take "barn finds" where a car has not been on the road for a very long time...is it really a good idea to not have an MOT on that? How about the enthusiast that is keen to get dirty on their car but has limited expertise or tooling. Also not everyone has access to a ramp to get underneath and properly inspect things. It's clearly a cost saving exercise and not a very well thought out one.
 
#5
I believe the problem is that the current MOT is to be replaced in 2018 by a universal European test which includes criteria (I have no idea what) that some older cars will not be able to meet even if in perfect condition. The obvious answer would seem to be a two-tier test, to ensure that older vehicles meet at least basic safety standards.

I don't really have a problem with the pre-1960 exemption, but a rolling 40 year is going to exempt a lot of high performance cars capable of practical every-day use.
 
H

hairyrover

Guest
#6
i think the problems will start when some un roadworthy,MOT test exempt wreck is involved in an accident. The government prompted by the anti old car brigade will then legislate all old cars into oblivion.
 

1396midget

Well-Known Member
#7
rockdemon said:
a stupid idea
yep, this

2549andy said:
The obvious answer would seem to be a two-tier test
and this.

I want my car to have an MOT. Without the need for one the temptation to keep things going that possibly shouldn't be will be very large. I'm not driving my P6 at the moment because it would fail an MOT on a rusty hole in the rear inner arch. I wouldn't have found it if I hadn't taken the wheel off to do an MOT check.

hairyrover said:
legislate all old cars into oblivion
This is very much the risk.
 

PeterZRH

Well-Known Member
#8
Actually in many US states there is no MOT equivalent, only the smog check and it doesn't seem to cause many issues.

I'd advocate a minimum check of braking, steering etc.and not much else for old vehicles.
 

1396midget

Well-Known Member
#9
PeterZRH said:
I'd advocate a minimum check of braking, steering etc.and not much else for old vehicles.
that's almost what we've got. Plus corrosion. And lights. I reckon there's not much in the current MOT that is of no relevance to a classic.

Also, do we know what's happened?

Government Website said:
Join the discussion on the Classic Vehicles web pages – this website will be open to the end of October 2014.
 

harveyp6

Well-Known Member
#10
There are lots of other conditions that will be imposed if the MOT exemption is introduced, regarding such things as modifications and use. But if you think adding to the discussion will make any difference at all you're deluding yourself. If the EU tell the UK government that it's got to be done, then it will happen, and what the likes of us think won't make a blind bit of difference.
 
#11
I can see a good business opportunity here for "Road Worthy safety test" for owners of fine classic vehicles. This could be rewarded by the classic car insurance industry. They could refuse insurance without one. The test would be remarkably similar to the current MOT test. If the EU wish to beef up the test why not simply have a two tier system. To a degree we have this now anyway as we are not tested for emissions.
 
#12
There are lots of other conditions that will be imposed if the MOT exemption is introduced, regarding such things as modifications and use. But if you think adding to the discussion will make any difference at all you're deluding yourself. If the EU tell the UK government that it's got to be done, then it will happen, and what the likes of us think won't make a blind bit of difference.
This is all tied up with the European Roadworthiness Directive. My understanding is that the EU wants to introduce a much stricter test, but individual states can opt out in the case of historic vehicles. Much of the discussion hinges around what is a historic vehicle, they have to be over 30 years old and historically correct, whatever that means, but it seems pretty certain that the definition of historic is going to be much tighter than hitherto, vehicles with major engine changes or replica and kit cars that take the identity of the donor vehicle are unlikely to make the grade. There is nothing to stop the government introducing a two tier test, but present discussions seem to be heading towards exemption.
 

sowen

Active Member
#13
I can't back this up with reliable data but I was under the impression that the question over defining what the UK government would consider a historically correct car is one that meets the DVLA's points system. The question then is how do the 8 points relate to the car, do the parts have to be original as in exactly what was fitted when it rolled off the production line or same/similar/equivalent to original which cover service replacement parts etc?

Worst case scenario for example is if the engine has been replaced like for like, then you lose that point, same for axle parts, gearboxes, springs, dampers (I'm sure I've also read that there is a list somewhere with serial numbers so these details could be checked if required?). Best case scenario is they leave it as it is here in the UK....
 

harveyp6

Well-Known Member
#14
I was under the impression that the question over defining what the UK government would consider a historically correct car is one that meets the DVLA's points system. The question then is how do the 8 points relate to the car, do the parts have to be original as in exactly what was fitted when it rolled off the production line or same/similar/equivalent to original which cover service replacement parts etc?
Currently DVLA seem to be totally ignoring the 8 point system.
 
#15
I can't back this up with reliable data but I was under the impression that the question over defining what the UK government would consider a historically correct car is one that meets the DVLA's points system. ....
The eight point system is the criterion for deciding whether or not the car's original identity and registration number are retained. If a car passes the eight point level and is historic, ie the original vehicle was built before 1st January 1975 then that status remains, but the definition of historic status in the future is still under discussion and it's not clear in my mind how the relationship between vehicle identity and historic status is going to pan out
 

sowen

Active Member
#16
Currently DVLA seem to be totally ignoring the 8 point system.
In what regards are they ignoring it, I've not come across anything rumors recently? I do know more cars are being flagged up for proof of identity.

The eight point system is the criterion for deciding whether or not the car's original identity and registration number are retained. If a car passes the eight point level and is historic, ie the original vehicle was built before 1st January 1975 then that status remains, but the definition of historic status in the future is still under discussion and it's not clear in my mind how the relationship between vehicle identity and historic status is going to pan out
But how do you define 'suspension' and 'axles'? Where does the 'steering' finish? Nobody seems to know the answer, though I believe it would be down to the opinion of whatever official does such an inspection?

I do worry about the implications of having a 'historic' status, and with all of the new-fangled computer systems the likelihood of severe usage restrictions being placed on such vehicles is increasing.
 

sowen

Active Member
#18
They are sending cars for BIVA even though they fall within the 8 point ruling.
Do you have any more details on this? Are these predominantly the cars that all of a sudden appear and apply for historic tax in line with the rolling tax exemption? I understand there is a letter that has been going out to some classic car owners demanding details of their cars for evaluation?
 

harveyp6

Well-Known Member
#19
Are these predominantly the cars that all of a sudden appear and apply for historic tax in line with the rolling tax exemption? I understand there is a letter that has been going out to some classic car owners demanding details of their cars for evaluation?
All of the above, plus some new imports.
 

sowen

Active Member
#20
All of the above, plus some new imports.
So are these going for outright BIVA or an identity check with somebody who was born long after they were manufactured? I'm still a bit confused as to what's happened in the last year as it appears to have changed since I bought a car two years ago and had to take it to a VOSA testing station for an identity check and the fiasco that followed...
 
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