De Deon Tube illustrated

GRTV8

Well-Known Member
#21
Hi All
It's been less than a year since I completed this and have noticed the boot is starting to crack.
There is no oil in there so the seals are holding out, just the boot......
This was sourced from one of the major P6 parts suppliers in the UK . This isn't an unusual occurrence from what I've read here but I don't particularly want to replace it on an annual basis.
My question is, has anyone found a source of a quality boot? If someone has, could you please PM me with where to get one. (so as not to upset any suppliers)
That would be much appreciated .
Peter
Rubber quality has certainly deteriorated over the years.
Ive always found the products "Scotts Old Rubber" from Melbourne to be very good.
As stated previous on this blog, my "Scotts" Dedion rubber boot has been insitu for over 10 years now ,but Ive gone down the grease road.
 

cobraboy

Well-Known Member
#22
As I have said before, we should not feel obligated to keep the identity of parts suppliers who supply inferior parts secret, and yet be always willing to reveal the names of suppliers who excel in quality items.
It is only by slowing up the trade in shonky goods that the suppliers will be made to re stock with better quality next time.
Reveal all I say, good or bad.
 
#23
Being new to this Rover thing I've discovered they had some unusual and quirky ways of building the P6. All rather fascinating but none more than the De Dion setup at the rear. Having scoured this forum looking for what's involved in giving said item an overhaul, I managed to build up enough info to start this minor job.
My one was leaking (oil in the rubber boot) and creaking. Ordered the kit, waited a month or so and made a plan. As mentioned various times in this forum, photo's are good. Actually they're great, you know, picture=thousand words stuff. And that is what I found lacking for a De Dion novice like me.
Sooooo, had my camera handy and started my little adventure.
Now, this is my first post here so still finding my way around and if it turns out a little odd, please forgive me. Also, the way I did the overhaul isn't gospel by any means. There are many here that can do this job in their sleep. I'm just sticking my photo's up for anyone else tackling this job for the first time to have something to work with.

My car is a 73 New Zealand assembled P6B that started life as an auto. (just in case that makes a difference or not:hmm:)

Here I have raised the car on the rear jacking point (solid rust less car) to allow the wheels to swing together compressing the tube to its shortest.
Also have removed the large hose clamp and drained the oil from behind the boot.
View attachment 16731

Have removed the bolts and the nuts from the studs. For some reason, or not, there were 3 studs on one side and one on the other.
View attachment 16732

Now I have lowered the car back onto it's wheels, thereby pulling the suspension apart again releasing the tube. (too easy, where's the catch....?)
View attachment 16733

This is where I cleaned out the tube elbows of years of built up road dust, Wire brushed them out and treated them with my favourite rust penetrator-preventer-sealer stuff. (technical term). No problems with these, just thin surface rust.
View attachment 16734
View attachment 16735
Rover special tool #1
View attachment 16736
Rover special tool #2
View attachment 16737 View attachment 16738

This is where the fun begins. Cleaning and seeing what I've got to work with as far as a 47 year old De Dion tube goes.
View attachment 16739
Little bit of scuffing/wear here (other end of the tube was the same). If you were to to jack the car up by the De Dion tube:hmm:, this is where the weight if the car will bear upon. I suspect the yellow bush is a plastic but I'm probably wrong. (again)
View attachment 16740
And spotless this side.
View attachment 16741

Cleaned out the air hole. This is to allow air to enter and leave the inside of the rubber gaiter/boot when the suspension is working. View attachment 16742
All cleaned up ready to assemble. Replaced all the bolts and studs with new high tensile bolts and lock washers. (don't throw your studs away though)
View attachment 16743
This is the position where the seal sits on the inner tube at normal road height when on the car. It squishes (another technical term) in and out when driving so the shiny part of the inner tube must be free from any defects otherwise the new seals will just leak again. Same again with the other end of the tube. If there is a problem, I'd suggest going the grease filled tube direction. (info elsewhere on the forum). Mine seemed perfect so oil fill for me (until proven otherwise).
The reason mine had leaked oil was the seals had hardened over time. When removed, they had about half the flexibility of new ones.
Note - I still have a serviceable retaining spring that I prefer to the cable tie that came with the kit. (it sits in the boot grove nicely:thumb:)
View attachment 16744

End plat and top hat (love technical terms) cleaned and treated for reassembly.
View attachment 16746


Filling the tube with 189.42 ml approx. (1/3 imperial pint for those not in the colonies) of the finest 20-60 mineral oil money can buy. This takes a bit of time as the gap between the inner and outer tubes is about 2 mm, the oil is thick and the air is trying to come out as the oil goes in.
View attachment 16748
This is the interesting bit. This is the exact angel the tube sits when mounted on the car. The oil is right up to the filler hole, just like in a gearbox and a diff. So there proves a point that has been discussed many times before. The filler hole is at this angle for a reason...:cool:
View attachment 16749

The tube now contains oil so care must be taken not to pull it apart although the retaining clip should stop it from doing so.
My choice is to seal the gaskets with a non hardening sealant to keep moisture from creeping in.
View attachment 16750

Before putting the tube completely together, I loosely reinstalled 2 studs on each elbow. This made realignment of the bolt holes very easy. After a couple of the bolts were installed, the studs were removed and stored for a later day (but where did I put them I will be asking myself). As well as the lock washers, I put a drop of loctite on each bolt. (overkill, I know).
The tubes have a spacing pattern for the bolt holes that allows it to be mated to the elbows one way only. This way the oil fill hole will be at the correct angle and facing upward toward the rear of the car. I didn't try it, but if the tube were to be mounted with the boot on the left (looking forward), the oil filler hole would be facing down towards the rear of the car. (and the air hole for the boot would be wrong too but that shouldn't be a big problem).
These last findings are for MY car. I haven't seen or worked on any other P6's and as many have stated, their boots are on the left. (Maybe grease filled with no filler hole, maybe different hole patterns, I don't know :rolleyes:(possible survey topic))
View attachment 16754
All done and pretty. No more squeak, no more leak???? will let you know over time. If it does leak again, I'll head the grease filled direction.
View attachment 16755

Have reached the maximum photo's for a post and have culled a few of the lesser images to make this fit. Hope this will be of use to someone one day.
I am happy to be corrected on any of my findings, This was how I tackled it first time round. It all went smoothly and, touch wood, stays fixed.
Cheers all,
Peter
Brilliant detailed information. Big thanks for sharing this as this is a task I will do for next year now. Pictures are a thousand words.
 

Peterv

Active Member
#24
Rubber quality has certainly deteriorated over the years.
Ive always found the products "Scotts Old Rubber" from Melbourne to be very good.
As stated previous on this blog, my "Scotts" Dedion rubber boot has been insitu for over 10 years now ,but Ive gone down the grease road.
"Scotts" no longer list the boot:(. Oil or grease shouldn't matter if there are no leaks:thumb:. When I replace the boot, I'm going to follow in your footsteps and go grease as the creaking has returned. (When I had the shocks out yesterday, I could get the car to bounce to its full suspension travel and find the last remaining creaks and groans. Trimming a whisker off a mud flap sorted out a random rub noise from my new bulgy tyres.
 

Peterv

Active Member
#25
Brilliant detailed information. Big thanks for sharing this as this is a task I will do for next year now. Pictures are a thousand words.
Your welcome. I have the advantage of being able to take reasonable photo's when under the car so do so whenever possible.
 

Peterv

Active Member
#26
As I have said before, we should not feel obligated to keep the identity of parts suppliers who supply inferior parts secret, and yet be always willing to reveal the names of suppliers who excel in quality items.
It is only by slowing up the trade in shonky goods that the suppliers will be made to re stock with better quality next time.
Reveal all I say, good or bad.
Your correct. But being dependant on remote trading I cant afford to burn any bridges especially with the smaller suppliers. I prefer to contact them directly and resolve issues out of the limelight. (but if that fails, it's open slather:LOL:)
 

corazon

Well-Known Member
#27
I reckon with enough googling and perhaps a purchase from China as the worst case scenario one could buy a suitable silicone version which shouldn’t ever need replacing again. I did a quick search using “Silicone bellows” and a lot came up
 
#28
I recently purchased a De Dion boot from Roverpart Of London ( yet to be fitted) The boot seems to be of good thick rubber quality. I will fit this boot shortly having gained a great deal of confidence from Peter's post and photos. Cheers Tom
 
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